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Married Women Who Play Free : Swingers Discussion 1424771051
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I know... the thread got a bit off-topic around the cheating thing. Swinging single per se can be an awesome part of this little hobby and tip of the hat to anyone who is in a good enough place in their lives to explore and enjoy it :)

Hopkinton MA
 
 
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Catnip said: "Cheaters"

This thread is not about guys and/or cheaters or the like... I willingly choose to keep any such creatures and any negative thoughts about them out of my spectrum…

This is all about us FUN WOMEN and our fun-filled lifestyle... It’s about our jollity, merriment and gaiety…

I define myself as a life-loving woman who likes to laugh, have fun, love others and let others love her... I'm clean, friendly, loving, caring, warm, tender, kind, thoughtful… and very playful.

That said, I respect other women who may choose other paths… hoping that they too respect my chosen locus and permit me to live it out…

Michelle

Sekiu WA
 
 
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You guys are absolutely right - this is all meant supposed to be fun, shouldn't get too serious, the main thing is being comfortable in your choices, and everyone's an adult making their own choices. No disagreement on any of that - it really defines the spirit of this whole thing!

But just because it's fun and you may be comfortable doing something that could hurt someone else doesn't make it "right". I don't call making the choice to selectively avoid that scenario "too serious", I call it "responsible".

I'm curious - if one of the "it's OK to be with cheaters" advocates here came down with herpes, what does your philosophy say about that? No longer swinging wouldn't be "fun", so as long as you're "comfortable with yourself" in exposing other people to that risk, it's OK? They ARE adults making their own choices, after all, and know that there are implied risks in this whole thing!

Part of having fun is knowing what kinds of responsibilities go with it, and not doing harm seems like a fair line to define. Even Disneyland has minimum heights for some rides...

Hopkinton MA
 
 
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Fitbody said: "This is about fun and when it is no longer fun you stop. Lighten up , life is meant to be for play, being serious make you heavy......... "

We are on the same page!!! Hey, I couldn't have said it better!!!

Some seem to wish to impose their own 'seriousness' and moralizing on our fun and carefree lifestyle which is all about letting your hair down and being light, casual and playful... I choose to relate to women (and guys!) like 'Fitbody' who love life, laugh, play, have fun and worry not about the heavy seriousness of some who prefer going through life moralizing, mopping and wailing…

Wake up, smell the coffee and cheer up! It's sunny, beautiful and bright outside...

Well said Fitbody! If you come out West, look me up and we’ll have some ‘guy’ fun together…

Michelle

PS: Don’t ever let the “judges” define who you are… I've always said... "FUN is my way of life... SEX is my way of FUN..." (and let the 'chips' fall where they may... lol... lol... lol...).

Sekiu WA
 
 
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I thought being heavy was because I eat too many chocolate chip cookies :/

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Michelle, we totally respect that you're not being completely wreckless in your approach and that you ARE trying to apply a filter to who you connect with, just like most of the rest of us. And we appreciate even more that you've clearly thought this all out and are willing to articulate your approach - it's really interesting stuff.

One analogy springs to mind when we read your approach, though - one about people who drink and drive. Most people don't worry about getting into a car if they had a glass or two of wine with a meal, maybe even 3 or 4. For some people it's vodka instead of wine, and/or 5 or 6 drinks or more. Everyone draws their line somewhere, usually with little regard to what the law says and more based on what they can rationalize as being "an acceptable risk" for one reason or another.

You clearly don't just do the equivalent of drinking as much as you want and hopping in a car - like you said, few cheaters can stay a whole night/weekend so you have a decent filter, and anyone could still lie about it if you asked. I guess for us, though, we'd still ask. Let them lie - they'd have to do it convincingly - because asking is at least then you doing your "due dilligence". Things can still go wrong (like them lying) but at least you've done everything most people would consider to be "within reason". It's a little bitty question, and if the other person's playing it straight then we can't imagine that asking them would kill any chemistry you have going on with them... it'd only buzzkill the cheaters who had any feelings of guilt...

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Catnipfun, thanks for your well thought out post. I respect your opinion and we can chat more about it via email.

However, I feel that I did not explain myself fully. Sometimes I'm not as good with words, so I'll rephrase my views.

It is not so much about 'morality.' When I meet a guy at a bar, club, party, M&G, or any other venue, if he is with a companion I know he 'has' someone be it spouse, friend or date. If he is by himself then it just does not work that I have to ask him what his personal life is about. We simply talk and play if we both want to and we move on. If he wants to see me again and we both like each other then it's fine and I go along with it. I don't want these guys to marry as I'm still married myself and even if I were not married, frankly, I would not be looking for a husband in the lifestyle as such. That said, I must tell you that I did meet my present hubby in the lifestyle where he was living with another woman but not married and I played with both of them a few times but then HE asked me out on a date without his girlfriend and the rest is history.

If I were to ask a married guy if he is married he could anyway tell me a story that he is divorced or separated or single or whatever. Guys can say anything they want the woman they want to have sex with to believe. I've been around the block. So my style is not to ask. I do not focus on that. I focus on the guy, if he is sexy, a good lover, funny, physically attractive, smart, etc. In a nutshell if I like the guy that's what is important to me and of course if he likes me. I DO NOT GO for he obvious guy who says he wants to meet me at a motel in the afternoon... lol... lol... If a guy wants to have me he MUST be free, completely free to play overnight, go to parties, etc. The so called CHEATERS are usually not free to come and go…

Generally a guy who can spend a Saturday evening and night plus a Sunday with me is for all practical purposes unattached. If I really like a guy I spend the entire weekend with him. How can he be attached to someone else?

Some time ago, I met a guy at a party. The hostess called me and said "I have this guy Pete who is coming to our party and has no one, could you be his date, he's cute and sexy and I think you'll like him. Some of our couples dislike having a guy without a companion present." I said to her 'sure.' We saw each other a few more times even once for a whole weekend. Eventually, after a couple of months he said he was married but leaving his wife. I lost track of him for a while but then I found him at a club with a girlfriend of mine who said he had left his wife and now she was living with him. So, was I guilty for not asking point blank: Are you cheating on your wife?

I'm not a nun. If a guy is available to play and visibly unattached, I'm game. If he's married, he is likely to be separated or on his way out of the relationship. I surely do not solicit married guys as such. I feel that (not you!) but some seem to wish me portrayed as a woman who is intent on breaking apart husband and wife and messing up relationships. That's not me. I'm a fun woman who enjoys the lifestyle to the max and set myself no arbitrary limits. Guys are guys. If I were looking to marry one, then I'd early on make sure he was 'available.' I'm looking for good sex and romance but not for a permanent relationship for as long as I remain married to my hubby back East. If I were to decide to stay out here West, then I’d leave my hubby but even then I’d not be looking to getting married once again unless I found some very special guy.

Michelle

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Michelle - At the end of the day we have to live with ourselves, and everyone has a different level of morality that they feel comfortable with. It seems silly for anyone within the lifestyle to judge anyone else when most of the world would consider that what ANY of us are doing is immoral or unethical (or in some countries even illegal). From that perspective, no judgement from us on your choices.

That said, there's a significant and definable line that you're crossing. You wrote "I just don't make a distinction between married or not", but there IS a distinction. When you get with a single guy, what you do with him is just between the two people who are involved in the choice to hook up. When you get with a cheating married man, there's at least a wife who is affected without her choice, and perhaps kids too.

This whole thread reminds me of the STD thread in one way. In the STD thread there are people who say "well if you're in the lifestyle then you're implicitly taking a risk, so why disclose what you have or even use a condom since they already KNOW they are taking a risk"? That thinking - just like rationalizations for cheating - are both arguments to ignore possible harm you could be doing to other people for a cause no more noble than your own pleasure. If you don't ask if they are married - just like them not asking you if you have an STD - does not mean as an adult you are absolved from the issue.

The two big problems we see with what you are defending are (a) there are uninvolved people who are affected when you cheat or help someone to cheat; and (b) it's not for any justifiable cause. You're not stealing to feed children, or castrating a serial child molester. There is nothing you're doing for anyone but yourself when you help someone cheat. Isn't that enough to just hold out for the people who do this openly?

One last thing - I truly appreciate that you gave a thoughtful reply, and if you'd prefer to chat about this in mail where the forum trolls don't just get belligerent, we'd be open to it! - J & A

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I'm back in San Francisco for those of you on the West Coast. I love this town. I was born here!

Michelle

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I feel that this lifestyle is about choice and preferences. What may turn on one person may turn off another and accepting each other's choices and preferences is the corner stone of being happy in the lifestyle. I also feel that my particular preferences may turn off some, but they are simply my choice and what turns me on, what 'works' for me...

That said, I've seen many good postings here with great 'insights.' Here are two:

Catnipfun said: "Open marriages arent for everyone (including us), but if it works for you then great. But honestly - why even bother with people who are cheating when there are so many others to pick from?"

I had two marriages that did not work for me because they were 'closed.' This one now works for me because it's open and I don't feel 'caged in.' I feel free and comfortable and love my lifestyle now.

About 'bother with people who are cheating,' I don't. I don't ask. For me if I'm attracted to a guy, I'm just thinking he is a guy who turns me on and is flirting with me and I want to 'experience ' him. I don't inquire about his personal matters such as whether he's married or not, working or not, how much he makes or not. Usually these topics don't come up until later. What comes up first is attraction and interests and flirting and being sexy to each other, etc. After sex sometimes there's more intimate conversation, sometimes not. So in all honesty whether a guy has his wife or girlfriend permission to be at a club or party or anywhere else does not come up.

Catnipfun said: "That said, we've met 3 wonderful couples over the years who met each other WHILE swinging back when they were married to other people. Not that you should fear it, but it DOES happen so you probably shouldn't be reckless either, should you?"

Yes, I too know several people who were a couple (some married) and found others in the lifestyle and left their original partners. But that is not typical of the lifestyle only. It happens everywhere. I feel it is VERY sad. I've a good number of couples I'm friends with and I'd NEVER even think of seducing their husbands or boyfriends. Friendship comes first. This statement might come to a surprise to some here as I feel some think that I'm out to snatch happily married guys and wreck their marriages but that has never been the case.

You are right, there are plenty of guys out there, I just don't make a distinction between married or not. If a guy is not approved by his wife he should not be out there in the first place but I'm not going to judge him as I feel that is something between him and his wife or girlfriend.

Michelle

Sekiu WA
 
 
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TOPIC: Married Women Who Play Free