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TOPIC: Married Women Who Play Free
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Michelle - At the end of the day we have to live with ourselves, and everyone has a different level of morality that they feel comfortable with. It seems silly for anyone within the lifestyle to judge anyone else when most of the world would consider that what ANY of us are doing is immoral or unethical (or in some countries even illegal). From that perspective, no judgement from us on your choices.

That said, there's a significant and definable line that you're crossing. You wrote "I just don't make a distinction between married or not", but there IS a distinction. When you get with a single guy, what you do with him is just between the two people who are involved in the choice to hook up. When you get with a cheating married man, there's at least a wife who is affected without her choice, and perhaps kids too.

This whole thread reminds me of the STD thread in one way. In the STD thread there are people who say "well if you're in the lifestyle then you're implicitly taking a risk, so why disclose what you have or even use a condom since they already KNOW they are taking a risk"? That thinking - just like rationalizations for cheating - are both arguments to ignore possible harm you could be doing to other people for a cause no more noble than your own pleasure. If you don't ask if they are married - just like them not asking you if you have an STD - does not mean as an adult you are absolved from the issue.

The two big problems we see with what you are defending are (a) there are uninvolved people who are affected when you cheat or help someone to cheat; and (b) it's not for any justifiable cause. You're not stealing to feed children, or castrating a serial child molester. There is nothing you're doing for anyone but yourself when you help someone cheat. Isn't that enough to just hold out for the people who do this openly?

One last thing - I truly appreciate that you gave a thoughtful reply, and if you'd prefer to chat about this in mail where the forum trolls don't just get belligerent, we'd be open to it! - J & A


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I'm back in San Francisco for those of you on the West Coast. I love this town. I was born here!

Michelle

Sekiu WA
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I feel that this lifestyle is about choice and preferences. What may turn on one person may turn off another and accepting each other's choices and preferences is the corner stone of being happy in the lifestyle. I also feel that my particular preferences may turn off some, but they are simply my choice and what turns me on, what 'works' for me...

That said, I've seen many good postings here with great 'insights.' Here are two:

Catnipfun said: "Open marriages arent for everyone (including us), but if it works for you then great. But honestly - why even bother with people who are cheating when there are so many others to pick from?"

I had two marriages that did not work for me because they were 'closed.' This one now works for me because it's open and I don't feel 'caged in.' I feel free and comfortable and love my lifestyle now.

About 'bother with people who are cheating,' I don't. I don't ask. For me if I'm attracted to a guy, I'm just thinking he is a guy who turns me on and is flirting with me and I want to 'experience ' him. I don't inquire about his personal matters such as whether he's married or not, working or not, how much he makes or not. Usually these topics don't come up until later. What comes up first is attraction and interests and flirting and being sexy to each other, etc. After sex sometimes there's more intimate conversation, sometimes not. So in all honesty whether a guy has his wife or girlfriend permission to be at a club or party or anywhere else does not come up.

Catnipfun said: "That said, we've met 3 wonderful couples over the years who met each other WHILE swinging back when they were married to other people. Not that you should fear it, but it DOES happen so you probably shouldn't be reckless either, should you?"

Yes, I too know several people who were a couple (some married) and found others in the lifestyle and left their original partners. But that is not typical of the lifestyle only. It happens everywhere. I feel it is VERY sad. I've a good number of couples I'm friends with and I'd NEVER even think of seducing their husbands or boyfriends. Friendship comes first. This statement might come to a surprise to some here as I feel some think that I'm out to snatch happily married guys and wreck their marriages but that has never been the case.

You are right, there are plenty of guys out there, I just don't make a distinction between married or not. If a guy is not approved by his wife he should not be out there in the first place but I'm not going to judge him as I feel that is something between him and his wife or girlfriend.

Michelle

Sekiu WA
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If you search the posts, no-one talks about fearing anything - they speculate about OTHER people fearing it, but no-one's expressed fears of their own.

We haven't met anyone in a LONG time (ever?) who feared for their spouses after the first experience or two, so would really doubt people "fearing" this if they bother to be in the lifestyle at all - can't do it without trust.

That said, we've met 3 wonderful couples over the years who met eachother WHILE swinging back when they were married to other people. Not that you should fear it, but it DOES happen so you probably shouldn't be wreckless either, should you?


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I do not fear anything for my husband. He is a an adult. He is very choosey and knows when to run away from a dangerous situation. Yes, I said run. Perhaps there is something else that people fear?

Augusta NJ
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Pretty interesting topic - it's REALLY interesting to see what some people are willing to rationalize as being "OK because we're adults" (if just being an adult was all the justification you need for doing anything, then what CAN'T we justify doing?)

We didn't think this was a tricky call before reading the various posts: for us it's always all good if everyone wants it and everyone knows about it. Whoever plays wants to play, and whoever isn't playing has explicitly approved. For us this means at times (though extremely rarely) we drive off our own ways to play with singles, sometimes with one half of a couple, but NEVER EVER without both of us agreeing and hearing from whoever's left out from the other couple (from their own lips) that they're good with the situation.

We're pretty unimpressed by people who encourage other people to play without their spouse's knowledge, but REALLY don't get it when the person doing the encouraging is a woman. As our unicorn friend put it: "as a single woman I can pick from a zillion options - why would I waste my time on someone who is cheating and who has someone at home who could be hurt by what I help him do?"

Open marriages arent for everyone (including us), but if it works for you then great. But honestly - why even bother with people who are cheating when there are so many others to pick from?


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Some appear to feel threatened by women like me who play both as a couple and alone. It seems they fear that by doing so we are after their husbands or partners.

That is far from the reality. There are great guys out here and everywhere available to those of us who choose to play at times without our regular partners. There are many hot and handsome guys to choose from.

Some are single, some are married. I've never had to solicit either single or married guys simply because they freely come to me at parties, bars, M&G, clubs, etc. Contrary to what some say, the guys are out there wanting to have sex and experience the fun life...

It also seems that there is a form of prejudice against single and married guys who rightly look for fun at the various venues where lifestylers play. Yes, some could be obnoxious at times but most of the ones I've played with are gentlemen and great guys both in and out of bed.

Michelle

Sekiu WA
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Lol... lol... lol...

In fact when I'm on the East (PA) I play BOTH as a couple (with hubby and others) and alone. Here on the West Coast (I just returned to SF from WA) I play BOTH as a couple with one of my boyfriends (Matt) as well as alone.

No one can define me simply because my actions and my friend speak louder than some who cast themselves in the role of judges and jury at the same time.... lol...lol...

Back to the topic at hand which is how women like me who play freely feel and what our experience is. I will be talking more about this once I settle back here in San Francisco.

Be well!

Michelle

Sekiu WA
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Your status is single? Is that to say your comments should not be considered as well? After all , you are wanting to hear what MARRIED woman think.

Augusta NJ
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I'm a very friendly and nice person... so why all these ill feelings? Can't I be myself and enjoy life without being criticized?

Anyway, the topic here is women who choose to play without their partners and their experience and feelings about it. If you do not play without your partner then the issue is moot.

Michelle

Sekiu WA
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TOPIC: Married Women Who Play Free