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Question to all you Bare Back only folks : Swingers Discussion 11760310901
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TOPIC: Question to all you Bare Back only folks
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Well -- I have opinions on that. I'm speaking mostly in general here -- this does not apply to all older swingers -- but to more than you would assume. Three reasons -- windows of opportunity, potency, and brains -- not so much in that order.

Getting herpes or aids is one type of problem when you are 26 and another type of problem when you are 56. If a disease or disorder means you will have to change your behavior for 3 years versus 30 years, then the misery factor or the need for protection may be different. Someone might argue that the motivational imperative should be the same if consequences are for the rest of your active life, but it is not. With decreased time of impact there is often unrelated but simultaneously an increase in proficiency in selection based on all risks -- the result is an alternative to condoms that offers more protection than condoms ever did. One reason alternatives matter is the following.

Potency, the nature of which is not what most folks think it is. To enjoy using a condom you must think -- evewn subconsciously -- a couple of things --

1) It is necessary because you can't come up with a safe concept of an alternative

2) If you can't scrogg strangers or promiscuites you won't have the smarts to keep yourself in enough sex partners to scratch your itch.

Being smarter about happiness and seeing the pitfalls and options better has a profound effect on those two factors.

The reason a lot of older people are less sexually interested later on is because of what they have to fuck. Viagra sales to aging men are as much because their wife -- and likely partners -- ain't what they once were -- as it is they can't get it up. In addition, there is the wisdom factor -- that little trollop you might be interested in when you are 25 or 35 or 45 -- something happens to a lot of people around 50 that makes that little trollop less worth the trouble -- she is no longer simply hot and available, but the drama and dissatisfying crap she brings with her count more. The trollop can become a turnoff as the desperation of rutting for all the ego reasons subsides.

Stupid shit you put up with when you're younger out of benevolent ignorance becomes something that you include as a part of the selection process when you see it enough. You can get to the point where you know people much better, you know life much better, you know your limitations and other people's limitations much better and your illusions are better grounded than when you are younger. Risk matters less after you put all these filters on who is even worth fucking. The preferences naturally select for a more safe, stable partner before the sex happens.

I know it can be hard to accept when you are 25, 35 or 45 but if you are on the ball your mind starts to process things much better as you see that opportunity for happiness is far more mental than physical. I used to have to strut and pursue and rabble on to get my nut, but nowadays I just put myself in the proper place and let the fruit fall into my hand.

I am graced to have a superhot wife who still considers me the best lover in all categories. That has kept me hard -- just blow on that thing. I have an almost shameful preference for young women for sex partners -- but I leaven it by knowing what sort of contacts will nourish me and which will be draining. I don't have a hard like that for women that would threaten my happiness by including me too much in their problems.

Life appears -- and gets -- more complicated when you get older. Instead of an annoyance which is how a lot of people see complexity, when you are older you realize that each of those complications includes alternatives and options. When you stop wincing at the complexity it can be quite relaxing to see twice as many options.

That's why they say youth is wasted on the young.....

Make any sense?

Brookhaven MS
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That's cool Seduction. That is the same reasoning that a good friend of mine uses to not get sexual with anyone except his mate.

He is a medical professional in a area that has a lot of HIV patients, and sees a lot. A statement he used for me was that a tiny skin pore is like an olympic swimming pool to a virus -- and there is no such thing as safe sex. He cites a long list of condom failures he a has witnessed. Just his opinion, of course, but he says what you and I do is not worth the risk to his union. He,he -- maybe he loves his wife more than we love ours -- in case that is sort of what you were saying to distinguish you and me.

I figure I have been doing the married swing thing since I was 20 (for the first 20 years I just called it fucking my friends) without STD casualty and in not too many years I am about to run out the clock. The longer my wife and I live the pickier we get, the fewer partners we have and the better we get at assessing risk of all the downside traits people can have -- translating to lower risk.

Single guys, cute but freaky girls who might be Crystal freaks in their private moments, Xanax heads who don't remember what they did Thursday of last week, and people who disdain examination and discourse are, for us, just a few examples of folks that would require a little extra getting to know, and a condom can be needed. We usually prefer to wait for better partners, but are capable of using a glove in a pinch.

Brookhaven MS
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I do believe Perfect is right on the reduced risk. And I think everyone knows that the term "safe sex" is bullshit.

The only question -- as we pursue sex that is safe enough to enjoy and still be thinking -- is there any protocol or method that can make sex without condoms safe ENOUGH to be desirable. I say yes. Not everybody is patient enough to pursue those methods, though.

Brookhaven MS
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"Perhaps Perfect will enlighten me on stats. And yes, I have taken statistics courses. But I would like to know your point of view."

Sure.

First you have to consider the chance of having sex with somebody that has HIV. Let's assume that probability is equal for the condom and the non-condom users. According to the stat given the condom user has only a 10% chance of being infected whereas the chance for the bareback is (?) maybe 50%.

So let's put some numbers in.

If we all have a 10 in 10,000 chance of having sex with an HIV positive, the condom user has reduced the risk to 1 in 10,000 whereas the bareback has a 5 in 10,000 chance of being infected. That's FIVE times more risk.

I have no clue if the above numbers used in the example are correct, and there are many other factors to consider but it's foolish to think that if you have sex bareback with only 10% of the people condom users do that your risk is the same.

Anybody who graduated high school should be able to understand it.

Pittsburgh PA
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Perhaps Perfect will enlighten me on stats. And yes, I have taken statistics courses. But I would like to know your point of view.

There is much media hype about the risks of barebacking. And there is much conflict in the studies that do pertain to risk. Some go so far as to call condoms safe sex, rather than the simple and not complete reduction of risk they are.

To me and others I've discussed this with, bareback is higher quality sex simply because there is more sensory input involved. It is more exquisite. Do most here have condom sex with their own mates? I understand there are many to whom there is too much sensory input when their cocks slide inside a wet pussy and condoms to them are a boon. But it is not so for me.

Enosburg Falls VT
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Perhaps the word "quality" has wrinkled some's egalitarian sensitivities and is confusing.

Values vary and what can be a "quality" couple for some because of traits that make them useful for bareback sex would not be quality points at all for a condoms only couple -- perhaps plainer if called more of an issue of "suitability".

fOR INSTANCEIf you are an always condoms couple and someone else is a bareback only couple then it would be a stretch to call that a "quality" score. Of course, many ladies who prefer bareback will allow a condom user male to have sex with them, while a condoms only couple would likely prevent a bareback only man -- that alone would constrict the relationship and render them a mismatch.

My apologies if I was too erudite in my word usage, or appeared to insinuate that ANYONE would not be looking for quality partners. Hell, around here, if you use whole sentences and proper grammar folks think you are too snooty to relate to -- most other places that trait is a good "quality".

Brookhaven MS
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Amazing........

Annandale NJ
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""The stats I've read give condoms a reduction of HIV risk of 90%. That means if you fuck 10 people with condoms to my one without, we have the same risk of HIV. This is the quality vs quantity risk adjustment."

lol. I guess you never had a statistics course/

Pittsburgh PA
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I don't really think whether a person chooses to use protection or not is really an issue of quality or character. I've known some people who were honest, respectful, and all around decent people who chose not to use protection, as well as people with the same character traits who did chose to use it. The same goes for people of bad character who make the same choices. As was previously mentioned, there are many different reasons why a person might choose to not use protection. Their specific reason can say more about their character than just the fact that they do or don't, out of context of why.

Summerville SC
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Not so much super beauty( what people normally mean by quality, which is fine if you want to add it on) I think by quality I and others who understand me on this know I am talking about folks who show a high level in the following traits:

honesty and openness

a somewhat studied examination of what they do as a habit

a lack of urgency that would interfere with their studied view

a value system that would give them the motivation to hold back a bit so they can still be honest and claim safety

an awareness of what diseases are out there and symptoms

In the above traits NO, people are ABSOLUTELY NOT created equal. And it only slights the caring to pretend we are. The Egalitarian pretense that it is snooty to notice these differences smack of a ruse created by the guilty to pretend they are more than they are. We are not talking about the right to be here on this Earth, we are talking about who gets some of your stuff -- or your wife's stuff.

These don't have to be a big pain in the butt to determine -- a lot of singles use the same strategy for selecting fuck buddies even if they are not going to pair bond with them.

Also I would caution against getting grossed out because of the stupid risks some barebackers take. There are some REALLY stupid people who think swinging is just a wonderful candy store for them. Despite the fact that some barebackers take incredible risks, some take fewer than the raincoat crowd. So people should not assume all barebackers are pensive, studious and cautious --- or the reverse.

Brookhaven MS
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TOPIC: Question to all you Bare Back only folks