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Walter Reed facility is rodent infested!! WTF : Swingers Discussion 740091051
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FORUMSGeneral DiscussionsPoliticsWalter Reed facility is rodent infested!! WTF
TOPIC: Walter Reed facility is rodent infested!! WTF
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SandJ wrote:

"In fact, I find the conditions at Walter Reed (and probably at every other Veteran's hospital in the nation) to be appalling and I feel they should be an embarrassment for this country, not something used to argue partisanship." -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Exactly! But, read some of the posts here and listen to the media loons and they make it sound if it is all Bush's fault.

My Dad, 4 Uncles, the farmer I worked for growing up and every other vet I have spoken with who served during WWII also says the same thing about veteran care during that time. Like you I also believe our caring for veterans began deteriorating during Vietnam, which was ending when I joined. The system fell apart under the Carter administration and the congress serving during that time. For about a 10 year period starting under Reagan, the entire military, to include support areas like housing, MWR and health care, improved drastically. Changes back to the status quo of today started about 2 years after Reagan left office. As I said, you had both republicans and democrats serving in the Presidency when these embarrassments started or continued i.e., Eisenhower, Kennedy, Johnson, Nixon, Agnew, Carter etc. It seems only two Presidents one a Democrat, FDR and one a Republican, Reagan ever went "above and beyond" in meeting not only the professional needs of our men and women in uniform, but their personal, social, family, educational and transitional needs as well.

Thanks SandJ for stating that this is not a President Bush problem, but a problem that ALL Americans should take responsibility for. Unlike certain retard posters on this site and those who spin shit in the media to make this President look bad, you are correct in the problem should identified and fixed without making it politically Bush's fault. By the way, it may seem that I am defending Bush, and indirectly I guess I am. However, as a conservative (or some say Libertarian) I want to point out that I DID NOT vote for Bush either the first time or during his reelection. I just find it appalling that the left personally demonizes him.

Minden NV
 
 
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SandN, I agree that it is not the blame of either party (or any party for that matter), but that it is a universal problem that has existed for a long time. But after saying that, I think it is a very good thing that this has been brought to the general public's attention in this way. That is what good reporting is supposed to do, regardless of what party is in power. And you know what? I don't care if it was done for a reason OTHER than informing the public - it did what it should have done in the long run, and make regular everyday people see a problem that has existed for years and not been acted on by ANY administration.

Last night, I asked my uncle, a veteran of WWII, if he thought the problems that exist now with the VA and DOD existed when he finally came stateside at the end of the war (he fought in both European and Asian theatres). He said that he felt the VA did a wonderful job after WWII, despite being overwhelmed by the number of wounded vets returning home. He felt that the disregard of wounded veterans health did not begin until the Vietnam era, and he felt that partly it had to do with the feelings about the war, but again, that's just his opinion.

Anyone who has served in the military is, of course, going to have a different view than the public who has not served. The public is NOT going to know what wounded soldiers go through on a daily basis until it is brought to light. I have a fourth article here, written by yet a different reporter, that I'm about to read, and I'm sure it will tell a horrid tale yet again (and yes, I know I'm late reading these, chalk it up to being far too busy during the week to do anything except work and family). Personally, while I make no bones about not agreeing with our actions in Iraq, I also am smart enough to separate the Walter Reed mess from that war. In fact, I find the conditions at Walter Reed (and probably at every other Veteran's hospital in the nation) to be appalling and I feel they should be an embarrassment for this country, not something used to argue partisanship . S

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SandJ,

Every time I visit the place to drop off phone cards or chat with the current active duty members, I have to "forcibly" keep a smile on my face. The facility is very depressing and I don't want the troops to see my disgust with the facility. The point I was trying to make is that the bureaucracy throughout the entire government is at fault here, it is not limited to the DOD or the Pentagon Leadership. They share in the responsibility, but it goes much higher, to both our congress and our President and his cabinet.

I also agree with you that the examples you gave do happen, but they have been happening since I first enlisted in 1974 until my retirement in 1995. Therefore I do not think it is a big leap to believe these types of disgraces within the military, active, reserve or guard, as well as within the VA are anything new. You pointed out that this country has a long history of not caring for those it puts in harms way. As a 21 year veteran, the records thing being reported is just not correct.

CNN reported, noon today, the General in charge was relieved of his command, and two high ranking GS (Government Service) civilians under him fired. I am a little concerned that two mid ranking officers and numerous enlisted personnel who work at the facility were also fined and reprimanded. Maybe they deserved some sort of getting their chain yanked, but I will bet that with what little operating expenditure/capital they were allotted they were doing what they were directed to.

Neither, Democrats nor Republicans have a good track record in providing proper benefits and care to those that are or have served. In my opinion, bills passed throughout the 80s and early 90s, damaged veteran care badly. The cuts and downsizing, started by President Bush in 1990 and accelerated under Clinton, went from one extreme, a large active duty force no longer necessary to one of a military too small and ill equipped. The "side" effect, for lack of a better term, is that this country does not take into account the long term cost of complete medical, dental, education and transition to the civilian sector that those who serve will require throughout their entire lives.

Again, I emphasize this is not the fault of democrats or republicans, it is the fault of all politicians as well as the American public, as a whole. From 1976 until 1980, I was assigned to Hahn AB, Germany, located in the Hunsruck Mountains. It was a WWII German Luftwaft base. The facilities, barracks, dining facility, and base hospital were all pre-WWII facilities. We had pest infestation, rats and low grade equipment. Yet the military community did there best and "soldiered on". Yes, we were all mad, at then President Carter, but as I got older I realized the system as a whole is cold to it's military component. The DOD is looked at by ALL politicians as a necessary evil. Only under President Reagan, did I see a real warmness and tremendous upgrade in facilities, equipment and care. However, I think President Reagan and FDR, were anomalies in their love and dedication to the care of our men and women in uniform.

Getting back to news reports. This should be exposed, but I think it is naive to believe that the media is not jumping on this story to make this administration look bad. These same conditions were present, not only at Walter Reed, but at other medical facilities during the Clinton administration. Yes, we are hearing of them now because of treating seriously wounded and disabled from our conflict and presence in Iraq, but a second reason is one of partisanship. I will bet that if a Democrat is elected President in 2008, these types of stories will go away from much of the main stream media, even though the problems will either continue or reappear. Just my two cents.

Minden NV
 
 
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SandN, you may be right, and you may be wrong. But I just finished reading the THIRD article written by different people, this one interviewing ACTUAL veterans who have had to put up with things that I had trouble comprehending, real trouble.

We have a black vet, with a blown off leg, being given a WHITE prosthetic limb. Way to go. He's brought it up to the people at Walter Reed-their actions? They did nothing.

We have other vets applying for treatment and benefits who are having to go through 20 different layers of people before anything is done. I don't know if you could call that 20 different commands or not, but it sure as hell is dissing the men and women who have served in this war. This country has done this for a long time - spend a lot of money fighting but very little to take care of the people they've sent into harm's way. Whether the outpatient facility is rat infested or not, there is no way any person in the administration can justify this treatment of our veterans.

And my apologies ahead of time for not having the time to come back in here (contrary to the Asshole's opinion, it is not because I think I'll get my ass kicked, rofl) S

Cambridge VT
 
 
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Commander of Walter Reed relived of duty and pending charges for behavior un becoming and officer.Well good for the DOD A little late I am afraid but atleast something is being done to make changes.

Saint Louis MO
 
 
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The Wikepedia article is inaccurate. First, NO military patient files documents with 22 different commands. With any medical procedure you fill out the appropriate paperwork i.e., lab forms, medical history etc, and that information is placed in your individual Military Medical records. Any person who has served knows this, or is currently serving knows this.

Second, no military patient pulls any guard duty. Currently the grounds are maintained by DOD Security Service. This is a civilian "cop" service that the DOD has maintained for over 50 years. All personnel are required to produce ID and sign into the hospital. Since many patients are visited by non-miltary family and friends, the ID does not have to be military. You can use your Drivers License, Passport, Sheriff's or State ID card to sign in. As far as Drug Dealers, I have visited Walter Reed at least a hald dozen times in the last two years and I have never seen this.

I will not argue about the condition of the building, it is in poor condition and it is made worse by the fact no more money is being placed into it, as it is scheduled to be closed. The condition of the facility has been inadequate for over 12 years, probably longer. The Pentagon has been asking for funding to remodel and upgrade the facility since 1995. At that time, monies were cut back and denied as "talk" of closure began. Only monies for the daily medical operations are being provided. Monies on major repairs or remodeling, outside of temporary "fix-it" done by the service members who run the facility, are no longer available. It is not deemed cost or taxpayer effective. My point is this is how the bureaucracy works on ANY closure and the results CANNOT be attributed to any one person, but only to the entire system.

We can argue or debate my terminology of consolidated versus combined, but that is petty. The point is Walter Reed is closing. Bethesda is expanding. The projected date of closure and the opening of the new facility are both projected as 2011. The new facility is on the grounds of the National Naval Medical Center, Bethesda, MD and is expected to be named "Walter Reed National Military Medical Center".

Minden NV
 
 
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Any one here ever watch mash? Its been ridicules for generations folks where you been? The last time things were even remotely squared away in DOD medicine was during WWII and even then they were deplorable. I work at the VA once a month to volunteer and I have never seen a more committed or more professional group of fine individuals working at this facility. And they show absolute care and concern for the individuals at this facility. And our wounded from Iraq and Afghanistan are at this facility. once they are discharged they are veterans. JNM: Why are't the conservatives of this site showing their outrage about Walter Reed??? Outraged you god damn right I am outraged. But instead of your congress doing something about it, they sit and moan like bitches about how GWB has fucked everything up, instead of DOING SOMETHING about the problem.

JNM: These responses not only demonstrate clearly the lack of concern for the troops, but a desire to change the subject and avoid the reality of the poor conditions at Walter Reed. Even Sen's silence on this crisis is conspicuous!

Fuck you!!! don't and you know why I state as much. Care? some on here have kids mixed up in this and you assert we don't care? who the fuck are you? I have gone for a day and wanted to stay out of here but you know I cant. The rest of the BS from Vegas and others I can deal with, but now you attack all of us here with your discontent for our Military and My son and his comrades. You truly describe pond scum...

Saint Louis MO
 
 
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Hmmm intrusting Post Susan......This is just what socialise heath care will look like!!!!

Miramar FL
 
 
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I posted this here because Walter Reed isn't going to be "combined" with Bethesda, it will be a new unit built on the Bethesda grounds. And the phase out of the actual Walter Reed won't be completed until 2011.

I visited Walter Reed many, many years ago and was amazed at the level of red tape that everyone, including the patients had to endure. Part of the following is an explanation, in Wikipedia, about the January 2007 article that was published:

The conditions of Building 18 of the Walter Reed Army Medical Center are described in the article as rodent and cockroach infested. Stained carpets, cheap mattresses, and black mold are other signs of neglect. No heat and water have also been reported by soldiers staying at Walter Reed. In addition, security is inadequate and "soldiers feel especially vulnerable." Right outside the unmonitored entry, "drug dealers work the corner at night." Struggling, injured soldiers, most suffering from PTSD, paranoid delusional disorder and traumatic brain injury, are forced to "pull guard duty" to obtain a level of security.

An attempt to alleviate the toll Building 18's condition takes on the wounded soldiers, a staff team headed by a clinical social worker at Walter Reed obtained a grant of $30,000 from the Commander's Initiative Account for improvements; however, "a Psychiatry Department functionary held up the rest of the money because she feared that buying a lot of recreational equipment close to Christmas would trigger an audit." By January the funds were no longer available.

Although the authors are quick to point out that "not all quarters are as black as" Building 18, "the despair of Building 18 symbolizes a larger problem in Walter Reed's treatment of the wounded."

"The typical soldier is required to file 22 documents with eight different commands-- most of them off-post-- to enter and exit the medical processing world, according to government investigators. Sixteen different information systems are used to process the forms, but few of them can communicate with one another. The Army's three personnel databases cannot read each other's files and can't interact with the separate pay system or the medical recordkeeping databases." This complicated system has required some soldiers to prove they were in the Iraq War or the War in Afghanistan in order to obtain medical treatment and benefits because Walter Reed employees are unable to locate their records.

And my apologies if this was already quoted somewhere in this thread!

And also sorry, but the boss says I have no more time to chat, and will have to be back later! S

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As part of a Base Realignment and Closure announcement on May 13, 2005, the Department of Defense proposed replacing Walter Reed Army Medical Center with a new Walter Reed National Military Medical Center; the new center would be on the grounds of the National Naval Medical Center in Bethesda, Maryland, seven miles (11 km) from Walter Reed's current location in Washington, D.C. The proposal is part of a program to transform medical facilities into joint facilities, with staff including Army, Navy, and Air Force medical personnel.

On August 25, 2005, the BRAC Committee recommended passage of the plans for Walter Reed National Military Medical Center.

The transfer of services from the existing to the new facilities will be gradual to allow for continuity of care for the thousands of servicemembers, retirees and family members that depend upon Walter Reed AMC. The final closure of the current WRAMC facility has been set for an unspecified date in 2011.

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TOPIC: Walter Reed facility is rodent infested!! WTF