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Whatever you say Robert.

Mickey.

Rayne LA
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Justus:

Now take that greenhorn, and make him disabled before be has any skills. What does he do to survive and provide for his family?

If I become disabled after my college, I can return to college and grab the research and development, or even enter into sales of said technology. Which is also an area that I can enter into for employment with my skills.

Hazle Township PA
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I'm probably going to regret this, but....

Your statement that engineers don't know anything that's not in a book is a pervasive opinion among employees in the field and is beyond idiotic. It is a major barrier when it comes to solving problems, as field employees and their scientific colleagues can accomplish great things when they work together and respect what the other brings to the table. "Usually" applies to everything I'm about to say.

What those in the field bring to the table: Practical experience and loads of observational data.

What those in the field do NOT bring to the table: An understanding of WHY things work the way they do and an appreciation for the fact that changing results means that SOMETHING changed in the conditions. Generally, their reasons are based on fucking with stuff until something works, and then when it does they conclude that what they did last is what fixed it. "Everything was exactly the same - sometimes it just doesn't work." they'll say. "NO. If the result changed, SOMETHING changed in the conditions. It could be something you don't know about, or don't think is important, or is beyond your control, but SOMETHING is different." They scoff at this and their refusal to accept it causes great problems with the problem-solving. They think they understand the reasons for what happens, but most of the time, they don't.

What scientific support brings to the table: Scientific approach to problem-solving and a strong understanding of the science behind the process involved.

What scientific support does NOT bring to the table: Practical experience and an understanding of the value that a lot of observations from field staff can provide. I fully appreciate this problem and I worked hard to overcome it.

When I worked my last plant job, I would make sure I would get out into the plant itself for 1/2 a day a week, talk with the staff about problems they had, and watch what they do, and sometimes do it myself. There is great value is learning what the field staff do, both in terms of gaining an appreciation for the problems they face but also to make them feel like I am accessible as a resource to add to their team when they do have problems. It took a long time for them to eventually begin to come to me with questions about what they were doing. I was really happy it eventually happened, because the communication between field and scientific support was near-zero when I came in (other than each just simply telling the other what to do).

Chesapeake VA
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Sexy that is how most all of as Bobbie sais learned our trades, That is why again like Bobbie sais our generation made some decent money from busting our balls to get a step up at a time. But then again Bobbie Idles the OWS type, ya know the ones aint never had their hands on anything other than a fucking devise texting and shit. I do not have any pitty on his kind, My dad taught us from a very young age that in life if you want something you work for it, He always also did say don't ever let anyone tell you what you can or cannot do. Here is another example Bobbie my bro in law has a 7th grade education, Like most all oilfield workers started at the very bottom, Ended up with ExxonMobll for way over 20 years retired them and is now a contracted drilling consultant making over 350.000 a year, But I know he is a damn slave working them long hours huh?

Mickey.

Rayne LA
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Excuse, me, Mr. RDY, but since I'm a Physicist, I am somewhat stung by that whack at Engineers. I sold newspapers and magazines starting at 8 years old, picked strawberries at 2c/quart, then worked on golf courses all thru high school and college, in a sheet metal shop, went to college, then worked in plant after plant, shiftwork until I was 30, then, ah well, enough of that shit. Just wanted to show you that Engineers learn from a lot more sources than books, but they have to get their asses out and into the action to do so. And I admit, one doesn't have to be a Bobbie to think he knows it all.

Wilmington DE
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Jesus Christ, my sons when they were 6 and 9 never has as many excuses as this little boy has. I guess it's just hopeless and somebody else can pick him up when he fall flat on his face. Wonder which generation he'll blame then.

Mickey you're absolutely right, I've never met an engineer that knew more then someone in the field. Engineers don't know anything that's not in a book.

Brick NJ
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Well I know this isn't an inspiring thought but: In a few billion years this will all be a big ball of ice and it won't matter what any of us did.

Live, die and have as much fun as possible in the middle.

Feel free to quote that lol

Lexington KY
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LOL, well, Rdy, so much for some good advice.

Wilmington DE
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Robert you say oilfield jobs leave people without skills? Proves just how much you do not know about the work force. Damn near every big money earner in the oilfield started at the bottom with zero EXP. But learned as the go, Hate to break it to you, but the very few college guys and gals in my field do not last very long in my field, for the simple fact that with all the high dollar education they have, They have zero on hands field Exp. So you keep pushing your schooling and make your pitiful wage while I still with zero college and not even high school diploma, Make a very good living. Please just admit the fact you will not work hard or ever over 40 hours a week, hence never have shit.

Mickey

Rayne LA
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Three things to keep in mind. First: It is never an error to explain ones reasonings, as it explains the problem more closely.

Second, job posting sites which are as general as the ones you have posted, will always advertise a lower than industry wage. It is how all wages become depressed, and these sites are targeted at the sonographers who's grades were not in the top 5-10% of the class.

Third, sonography vs truck driver. Which form of employment holds skills which can be taken into another related or unrelated field?

I have most every 101 to 120 class out if the way. While this should have been done years ago, I had no one to direct me in how to use college to my advantage. I had to be my own teacher.

After my college is complete, and should I not find a job, I can return to college and continue my medical studies to widen my sonography skills. Further with a background in sonography, I could enter into the R&D for advancing sonography.

Finally, as I advance and gain knowledge, I will be enabled to better understand how medical books are written, perhaps I would begin to write and sell my own.

What can a truck driver do? Sit with a steering wheel, eating fast food and bathing in public sinks between gas stations? You pay for your own rooming, food, and more often, maintenance on the trucks. Not to mention the many fines dot will issue against you.

Hazle Township PA
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