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Poll for gun enthusiasts: Should people with mental issues have guns : Swingers Discussion 2213031051
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TOPIC: Poll for gun enthusiasts: Should people with mental issues have guns
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PP,

First, lots of people around here will get quite a kick about you referring to me as a "right leaning folk."

Second, there are all kinds of laws that prevent the integration of databases. For one, HIPPA regulations prevent the sharing of health information, except under very specific circumstances, and gun checks are not one of them.

You are confusing looking for a specific instance vs. a comprehensive system of background checks. The first is an ex post facto search. Pretty simple query. The second is predictive modeling, which is orders of magnitude more complex.

Lakeside CA
 
 
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TBR it depends on the state. If a state is shall issue the sheriff better have a good reason for denial. He may have to explain it in a hearing, and I doubt he wants to tell a judge in front of other people the person he denied was banging his wife.

States like CA and NY have may issue, and they really do not need any excuse to deny, they just do it.

Illinois has no permits per say, but for a nice political contribution one can become a non merit deputy with all the powers of a merit deputy. Including the carrying a concealed weapon.

Sanford NC
 
 
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tbrmskss ...Your argument is actually one for eliminating the office of a county sheriff altogether. You right leaning folks need to make up your mind, do you want local control or federal oversight? The fact is, we tackle things a LOT more complicated than universal background checks every day as we speak, and this may scare the crap out of some people, but there is no need for any new generation of data bases or bureaucratic legions, the data on each and every one of us already exists, and yes, that applies to our guns as well I had to LMAO when there was a debate over the creation of a "national registry" 95% of what the BATF does is process requests from local, county and state law enforcement agencies to track and trace guns used in crimes from sale to resale to theft, to resale again evidence room,,,where in HELL do you think they get that data???? The only thing missing is to integrate the data bases where this info already exists.

Rosemont IL
 
 
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Leaving the issuance of gun permits on the opinion of the county sheriff is not optimal, by any means.

What happens if the individual just doesn't like you? Maybe you fucked his daughter, or insulted his wife, or some other thing that has nothing to do with your mental health?

But I don't think anyone would like it if we have a comprehensive database of your life in order to make a decision on your ownership of firearms.

That is where the people who are talking about restricting firearms from the mentally ill are deluded. The laws that would need to be changed make it impossible to do...

Lakeside CA
 
 
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tbrmskss ...In the vast majority of cases, you don't need psychological testing. In the vast majority of cases, by the time someone reaches adulthood, anyone with any common sense can look at some sipmple recoords and make some common sense decisions In NY State, LONG before the recent changes in the Law in NYS, the state outside the the 5 boroughs had and still has what I conciser THE best gun regulatory system in the US..bar none To own a handgun, you need a permit, this is in addition to CC. The decision is made by the COUNTY sheriffs department, and the elected Sherrif has to sign off. Keep in mind, in most counties in the US, there are less than a quarter million people, and in Upstate NY, some have less than 100,000. Quite simply, if a local yahoo, hooligan, wife beater or general whack job applies, someone is going to know about them, and thus it is denied. When I moved to Illinois, I LMAO at people damning Illinois for not having a CC law, when in fact NY had one, but it was easier to get a FFL then a NY state pistol permit. So if a deputy does a drive-by of the house where someone has a pending application, and there is an upside down American flag, a snake banner and a sign that says "I came unarmed, THIS time", and the guy has been in the lock-up 5 times for domestic abuse, he is gonna get denied Right wingers should LOVE this, since it is LOCAL control.

Rosemont IL
 
 
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Exactly.

Brooklyn Park MN
 
 
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"Do we have any psychologists in here who could help us understand the kind of mental illnesses that would be predictive of violence?"

The data is incomplete. I would venture to say that most people who are diagnosed with serious mental illness because of some violent outburst are done so after the event. Dahlmer, Gacy, Ramirez, the list goes on.

Plus, we are not really talking about these high profile cases. Most people who die by firearm we will never hear of. The gang banger or his victim have probably never seen a psychologist. Nor has the guy who is cleaning his gun while having a beer or twelve, and gets just a little too tired of his wife's nagging.

And can you imagine the outcry if there were a requirement for psychological testing? We can't get uniform background checks on a federal level...

Lakeside CA
 
 
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Good..."The Constitution", like it or not, is more than the text of the original document and it's amendments. It is subsequent SCOTUS opinions, it is the USC, and it is de-facto Constitutional implementation upheld by courts. He asked it it was Constitutional, not if it was specifically enumerated. That would have been a 3rd question, to which I would have answered NO as well, by virtue of the first 4 words of the second amendment.

Rosemont IL
 
 
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The first question asks an individual's opinion, the second question asked if the constitution forbids ownership of "arms" based on a mental issue.

I do not believe any part of the constitution, or its amendments excludes any individual (Citizen? Resident?) from arms ownership. Other laws restrict ownership by an individual when a person's rights have been removed. Example- a convicted felon for a specific period of time after serving their sentence.

Brooklyn Park MN
 
 
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There is absolutely no logical argument to support a mixed decision on these two questions. It is either both yes or both no, nothing else is either logical, consistent or rational.

Rosemont IL
 
 
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TOPIC: Poll for gun enthusiasts: Should people with mental issues have guns