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Israel Palestinian conflict : Swingers Discussion 200102101201
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TOPIC: Israel Palestinian conflict
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My point is that, the palis aren't seeing their actions as wrong. Even when they celebrate suicide bombers.

Despite Bibi's stubbornness, I doubt he'll go for the pullout.

Rumson NJ
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Neither was ok.

East Fishkill NY
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PA against Barak call for unilateral pullout By KHALED ABU TOAMEH 05/30/2012 17:27 The Palestinian Authority Wednesday voiced opposition to any Israeli unilateral moves, saying this would end the idea of a two-state solution.

The PA's announcement came in response to statements made by Defense Minister Ehud Barak.

Nabil Abu Rudaineh, a spokesman for PA President Mahmoud Abbas, said that any Israeli unilateral withdrawal [from the West Bank] would lead to the establishment of a Palestinian state with provisional borders - something that the Palestinians are opposed to." =============================== Of course the palestinians are against the pull out, the action will leave them with no negotiating power, and all the advantages in Israel's hands.

It will create a chaotic state in the West Bank, similar to the chaos in Gaza. Result will be as usual, violence against Israel, which will earn these people Cast Lead rewind. But what I find really hypocritical is that, just last year, Fatah acted unilaterally when they went against the advise of the US, in front of the UN to request statehood. Why was that ok, but this is not?

Rumson NJ
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Madonna filled a huge audience Israel, where she began her MDNA 2012 world tour.

I loved her message to Israel:

Many of us talk the talk, but how many of us walk the walk?

A jab at all the douchies that decided to launch an artistic, cultural, and academic boycott of Israel.

Elton John, before his last tour in Israel was heavily pressured by the terrorist sympathizers, to not perform in Israel. Elton's response was:

My job as an artist is to unite the world through art and music, and not get involved in politics.

Rumson NJ
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JERUSALEM — There are signs the Israeli government is considering taking unilateral action if peace talks with the Palestinians remain stalled, a move which could involve a withdrawal from parts of the West Bank along the lines of a 2005 pullout from the Gaza Strip.

Defense Minister Ehud Barak told a high-profile security conference on Wednesday that inaction is not an option and Israel cannot wait forever to reach an accord.

"Israel cannot afford to tread water," Barak said. If a deal "proves to be impossible, we have to consider a provisional arrangement or even unilateral action."

The statement reflected a growing sense of urgency in Israel about ending its 45-year entanglement with the Palestinians, even if no peace deal is possible.

Two decades of on-again, off-again peace talks have failed to yield an agreement, and negotiations have been frozen for more than three years. And as time passed, a shift of thinking has quietly occurred in Israel: The occupation of Palestinian lands may ultimately be bad for Israel simply because ruling millions of Arabs will demographically sink the Jewish state.

Rumson NJ
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The United States is leading what it described as the "largest military exercises in the Middle East in 10 years" in Jordan on Tuesday.

Eager Lion 2012 “is the largest exercise held in the region in the past ten years,” Major General Ken Tovo, head of the US Special Operations Forces, told reporters in Amman.

“Yesterday we began to apply the skills that we have developed over the last weeks in an irregular warfare scenario … They will last for approximately the coming two weeks,” he added.

“The message that I want to send through this exercise is that we have developed the right partners throughout the region and across the world … insuring that we have the ability to … meet challenges that are coming to our nations,” Tovo said.

Over 12,000 soldiers are taking part in the war games, representing 19 countries, including Bahrain, Egypt, Iraq, Jordan, Saudi Arabia, Lebanon, Pakistan, Qatar, Britain, France, Italy, Spain and Australia.

Jordanian army operations and training chief Major General Awni Adwan said the military exercise “has been in the planning phase for the past three years.”

“No forces will be deployed north … the exercise is not connected to any real world event,” Adwan said when asked if the war games were related to the ongoing violence in Jordan’s northern neighbor Syria.

"This has nothing to do with Syria. We respect the sovereignty of Syria. There is no tension between the Syrians and us. Our objectives are clear,” Adwan said.

Israel – despite having extensive security agreements with Jordan – was not invited to participate in the exercises. Several Arab nations participating in the drill are still formally at war with the Jewish state.

Washington has granted Amman $2.4 billion in military and economic aid in the past five years, according to official figures

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Ynet recently published a story, “Shin Bet seeks to raze Itamar terrorists home“, which reports on a recommendation presented to Israel’s defense minister to approve the demolition of the homes of Amjad and Hakim Awad, who were responsible for Fogel family massacre in Itamar over a year ago. (A young family was mercilessly slaughtered while they were sleeping; Mother, father, 1 toddler, 1- 10 year old boy, and a newborn, their throats cut while they slept).

A few months ago Palestinian Media Watch reported that the PA’s official television channel, on a program devoted to Palestinian (terrorists) imprisoned in Israeli jails, featured a telephone interview with the mother and aunt of one of the murderers of the Fogel family. The mother praised her son and said that he was one of the two who had carried out the “operation at Itamar.” Hakim Awad’s aunt called him a “hero and legend.” The program was broadcast twice (PMW, January 29, 2012).

However, in addition to the lack of remorse by the killer, the cruelty of his family towards young Tamar, and the cover up by Awad’s relatives, the Ynet story cited above also included this, which suggests that killer’s families aren’t the only Palestinians who have engaged in such reprehensible moral behavior after the massacre.

In fact, a poll conducted last May (2011) in the West Bank, Gaza and E. Jerusalem demonstrated that nearly one-third of Palestinians explicitly support the murder of the Fogels.

Clearly, even the most undeniable evidence that the killer’s family, and their broader community, continue to the laud the behavior of Amjad and Hakim Awad (the palestinian killers who sneaked into the Fogel family house while they were sleeping) will never find its way to the pages of the Guardian.

According to a poll, 32% of the 1,270 Palestinians in the West Bank, Gaza Strip and Jerusalem that participated back the attack in which Udi and Ruth Fogel and three of their children were killed.

w ww.haaretz.co m/news/diplomacy-defense/poll-one-third-of-palestinians-support-itamar-massacre-1.354477

Rumson NJ
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While there's potentially plenty more to be said on the issue, it should be said on the new civil war thread, agreed.

Chesapeake VA
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While the civil war was mostly about state rights, the south the banning of new states from adopting slavery as an attack on slavery and the right of the state.

Something that these southern states had to learn was that as a nation develops... it must become more unified under a common government. You are seeing this across the world today with the number of nations that exist independent of each other becoming fewer and fewer.

The boarders to these nations are dissolving, the importance of citizenship within these nations is being reduced and the very concept of being a citizen of a single nation becoming blurred.

You can't exist within a bubble of independence if you want to be part of something bigger than yourself and that is what the southern states wanted to do. They wanted each state to be next to independent of the greater nation, and to be allowed to continue slavery. Where there other issues of state rights? yes.. but the only issue of importance was slavery of another human being, and NO issue worthy of war.

As far as I am concerned, every general of the South should have been hung, every congressmen or leader of the south, imprisoned and all property taken to pay for war damages caused by the treasonist actions of the South.

Even in the 1800s, this nation had a vote, the people a vote. That is how a civilized nation decides its future and if the number of people who see things in one light are too few... they DO NOT have a right (in any definition of the word) to take up arms so long as the vote remains. (which the power of the vote did in fact remain.)

enough said on this issue.

Hazle Township PA
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You misunderstand 8inch......

I always contended the Civil War was largely about states rights vs the federal government. I'm just amazed we agree on something - especially something people consider controversial.

Chesapeake VA
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TOPIC: Israel Palestinian conflict