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FORUMS General Discussions Politics Increased Minimum Wage
TOPIC: Increased Minimum Wage
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Lucky

A few thoughts. You apparantly pay more than the minimum wage and therefore there is NO mandate by the government to increase the wages of those you employ. But you also apparantly pay less wages than your competitor (who I assume were also paying more than minimum wage and were also NOT mandated by the government to pay more) who decided to pay more for what they considered "trained employees". The end result is that your competitor has hired away 2 of your trained employees saving them the time and expense of having to train them and as long as they pay more than your company they will continue to hire away employees from you after you have trained them. Let me give you an example of a recent family happening. My wife was contacted by her ex employer (hasn't worked for them in about 3 years). He told her they were behind and wanted to know if she woud come back for a few weeks to help them catch up. They paid her about 12.25 an hour when she quit for college studies. She asked for 15 an hour to bale them out. The owners son, now running things on a daily basis, told her "ain't gonna happen". She told him he was right, it wasn't gonna happen on her end either. Here you have a company wanting help from an ex-employee who is already trained, can work alone and would rather pay minimum wage, take the time to train, use a managers time to do the training, plus being in an industry where "good" people are hard to find; maybe one employee in 20 work out and they'd rather hold out for that person than pay a little extra and get caught up. That in my book is greed and you get what you're willing to pay for.

Since the minimum wage had not been increased for 10 years you have a good memory of when exactly the unions get into their labor disputes. Was the last labor dispute with any unions 10 years ago? If you answer honestly the answer is no.....there are labor disputes annually from various unions. It is the auto makers this go around. And in this case they appear not to be asking for higher wages but instead are trying to stop or minimize wage contractions. You however, like to take any instance of union negotiations or lay offs and try to show cause and effect by minimum wage increases in circumstances where the company themselves do not sight that as a cause.

St Petersburg FL
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And as far as studies go I am my own study and dont care about some yahoo sitting behind a desk thinks about how my business is run, I see it for my self.

Imperial MO
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Great discussion. I love stirring things up...LOL

I have been very busy lately. Murder rate is up and the enviroment has been threatened 4 times as of late.

My point is every time the Min. wage question comes up the Unions seem to have new contract negotiations coming up. Awefully convieniant wouldnt you say? The what about me generation seems to have this knack of stepping up operations at the most opertune times. After all when this was passed by congress the first words out of 2 of my employees was so when does our raise come? I said when hell freezes over. They get a raise once a year and that is a merit raise, We take into account tardiness and days missed and behavior on the job and of course the qualifications and training completed. I dont need the fed or state to tell me how to pay my employees. Since the increase I have had to replace two people who went to the compitition for higher wages. These companies have increased wages since the vote went in. I can not and will not change the peramiters for paying my employees just because some High school student got a .70 raise or some retiree who didnt plan for his own future.

Imperial MO
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Look back a page for examples.

Cheers

Fullerton CA
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tbrm Sound bites can be construed as "spinning". I don't know if you are using the term to minimize my comments. Legislation on either the federal and state levels should be one of promoting economic growth to those that are creating the opportunity of others: the entrepreneurs.

Nonetheless, it appears that you have some knowledge, albeit as an employee who does consulting. But to whom? If it's small business you are providing consulting to, you would know that any increase of cost in any area that is mandated by the government can be - and usually is - material.

In the aggregate, you have some truth. What happens is that when an employee is terminated, that person would either seek employment elsewhere - now with more experience - or would start their own enterprise. In this scenario, they start at ground zero with the hopes of growing their company...another vicious cycle begins anew.

I've helped many new startups from individuals who were former employees of clients. And I've had clients who gave up and decided to be employees of others - this is a rarer case.

Fairfield CA
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dandm-

There is certainly some debate regarding minimum wage effects on small business, and by definition, studies take an aggregate look. So there will be some losers and some gainers. But in the aggregate, across multiple states, the effect of increases in the minimum wage on job growth has been negligible.

Not to mention the worker's compensation problem in California over the past several years. My previous employer (about 1500 employees) was getting million dollar WC premium increases. Even on a 100 million budget, that is quite a hit. Thankfully that has abated somewhat. They actually got quite a refund from previous years increases this year. Buck Knives, one of the big employers in my city, moved to Idaho, mostly because of WC increases and utility rates.

I can understand somewhat the pressure on small business. I do a fair amount of consulting work, and last year was quite challenging on the tax front.

As usual, this is a complex issue and is not solved by sound bites.

Cheers

Fullerton CA
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Studies are just that...studies that sometimes go unchallenged.

Small businesses is my business; they are my clients. I currently have over 350 micro to small business clients and I have been in the business since the early 1980's. Since then, I have had over 3500 small business clients. The issue about minimum wage has always been a concern to them because it is tied with other mandates.

Fact: minimum wage is usually the high schoolers and entry level positions in a field not requiring much brain work and not the bread winner of the family; minimum wage increase is ALWAYS tied to union wages - it is in their clause; minimum workers usually see a decrease in take home pay because, if they have a second job, the tax rates are progressive; restaurant workers who usually get the minimum wage is usually increased by the tips they earn - giving them an average between $10 - $20 per hour (determined by the revenue the restaurant they are employed with).

I have testified before state legislators in California on issues raging from minimum wage to workers compensation reform. I am thoroughly experienced in this.

Fairfield CA
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Most studies disagree with you.

Fullerton CA
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tbrm - and everyone else who agrees with you: Again you are misguided. You state that an increase in minimum wage does not cause an increase in unemployment.

Let me tell you what it does cause: Business stagnation; increased payroll taxes; increased workers' compensation insurance; decreased in owners take home pay; neutralizes recruiting additional employees;...

This impact affects the small business owners. The larger companies absorb the impact by re-channeling their budget. (I can make a longer list on this one.) So the fact that it MAY not cause a fluxuation on employment numbers, it does affect the growth of the business and the ability to compete with international firms.

It is obvious that you sign the check on the back side not the front.

Fairfield CA
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This years contract dispute is NOT the union asking for higher wages. This year's discussions are over 2 issues.

1. The automobile manufacturers (GM, Ford & Chyrsler) want to reduce or eliminate a $25 per hour wage gap in order to compete against Japan. That is the union wages are $25 per hour greater than the Japanese pay. Therefore, the auto makers want to pay the UAW union workers less than they currently earn.

2. The auto makers (GM, Ford & Chrysler) want the retiree health care shifted to the union in order to get the liability for health care of retirees "off" their books to make their balance sheet look better to investors, hopefully increasing their market price of their stock. This is basically a false savings to the investors because the auto makers want to give the money to the unions who would record any health care of retirees on the union books instead of GM, Ford or Chrysler making it look as though the auto maker has less liability when they are in fact paying the money over to the union.

None of their current disagreement has one thing to do with minimum wage increase of 70 cents. They want to lower the wages paid to the union workers to compete with Japan and shift a "books" liability from the maker to the union.

St Petersburg FL
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TOPIC: Increased Minimum Wage