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Good point! : Swingers Discussion 787781011
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TOPIC: Good point!
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eandr you are confusing the Declaration of Independance with the Constitution. The Declaration of Independance was written to separate us from England. It gives no laws but outlined the violations by the King to the Colonies. It speaks of the rights that were violated by England. It is not a set of laws. Here is the rest of what you posted a piece of: We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. — That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, — That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness.

This is the Colonist saying they are abolising their union with England and creating their own country which will have their own laws, that their citizens will have to abide by.

Spencer TN
 
 
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"Illegals should not have a right to work here, illegals do not have a right to free health care, illegals do not have a right to send their illegal children to schools here, illegals do not have the right to demand that we learn another language because they are too lazy to learn English."

Sure they do. They have the right to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness just the same as you. I thought we already established this?

The question is not whether they have those rights (they do). The question is whether or not you can use your government to expunge them of their inalienable rights, endowed upon them by their creator (you can't).

You can certainly try, but you're ultimately destined to fail.

See, when you try to take away the inalienable rights of men through government those sorts of governments always ultimately get altered or abolished. It's just a matter of time before it happens.

"I will never learn Spanish. I refuse to learn another language to communicate with someone in my country. If someone wants to speak to me they can speak English."

Well, I suspect your children will have to. Or at least your grandchildren. Those who refuse to assimilate to the new American language and culture will most likely find themselves relegated to the subservient status, employment and roles to which todays illegals are functioning in.

Goose Creek SC
 
 
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I ahve not seen him here for a few days I thought he may have been the guy in SC who was arrested for drugging his wife and locking his kids up. :) Just Kidding eandr, was it a friend of yours though? LOL

Spencer TN
 
 
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A government that is necessary says it is so. There has to be a government. There has to be laws. There has to be laws to protect the citizens, not only from the government but from each other. There has to be laws to protect the country as well. If there was no government or no laws then there would be chaos and anarchy. Do we possibly need to reform our government and get rid of the career politicians? Place honest people back in office like our founding fathers? Yes, that is why we vote. Illegals should not have a right to work here, illegals do not have a right to free health care, illegals do not have a right to send their illegal children to schools here, illegals do not have the right to demand that we learn another language because they are too lazy to learn English. I will never learn Spanish. I refuse to learn another language to communicate with someone in my country. If someone wants to speak to me they can speak English.

Spencer TN
 
 
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"Yes rights to live trumps the government, but the right to be here illegally is against the law."

It's only against the law because the government says so. In the absence of government there is no law and hence its no longer illegal.

You see, there's even a third clause in the Declaration of Independece.

"That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it"

So, to summarize:

Men, all of them, have rights. Even illegals. Life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. These are *inalienable*.

To Secure these rights, men create governments.

When these governments become destructive to these rights, men alter or abolish said governments.

This is just the way things go. There's nothing you can do or say to change it; it is well documented though out the history of nations.

Knowing this, which path do you think is going to be taken in regards to *illegals*??

If I were you I'd be learning Spanish.

Goose Creek SC
 
 
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Isn't there a difference though between an immigrant and an illegal alien?

Spencer TN
 
 
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Yes rights to live trumps the government, but the right to be here illegally is against the law. I will deny no one food, but I would prefer to feed an illegal in a holding cell while they are waiting to be deported.

Spencer TN
 
 
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"Too bad that statement was not put in the Constitution."

It doesn't make it any less true. And if you read the statement that *follows* that one, those RIGHTS are the reasons governments are instituted among men (not the other way around).

You see, all men have certain *inalienable* rights whether governments exist or not. Even *illegals*.

And they wouldn't be illegal if a government didn't declare them so. But their rights trump your government.

Goose Creek SC
 
 
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eanr, Too bad that statement was not put in the Constitution.

Spencer TN
 
 
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"If the cheap labor is gone then the employers would have to make less profit and pay more."

That cost is passed along to the consumers (citizenry). It means you're going to have to pay *a lot* more to get your house re-roofed etc. Of course, your employer is not going to raise your salary immediately just because the cost of living suddenly jumped enormously due to a mass exodus of illegal labor force.

Hence, a severe catastrophic depression would likely set in.

Goose Creek SC
 
 
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TOPIC: Good point!