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Court Backs Ban on Abortion Procedure - Partial Birth Abortions : Swingers Discussion 77431101
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TOPIC: Court Backs Ban on Abortion Procedure - Partial Birth Abortions
Created by: 38specials The original post for this thread was deleted.
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Mike,

I personally don't like abortion, but the key word is personally. In our form of government and the liberties we cherish we do not legislated and force others to adhere to our personal beliefs. Now; I too agree with you that an unborn baby is human life, but much like the global warming argument, the "experts" and scientist disagree on that. Even though I suspect it is at the point of conception itself, until there is a majority consensus, I will reluctantly support the need for the government to stay out of my life. As a man that also means my body and the things my body controls. I would like to apply that same standard to women and therefore have to acknowledge that since they have babies and men do not, they should be able to have the greatest say over their bodies.

My beliefs concerning abortion and any need for social and government legislation are fluid and have changed along with modern medicine. As medicine has become more advanced and we are finding a baby can develop and thrive outside the womb at 8 months, 7 months and even less, I hope several things will happen. One, that abortionist will discover that life cannot be defined by a 9 month birth and second, that abortion should be used as a last solution, not a method for "birth control" or to get rid of a "mistake" that gets in the way of someone’s life (to me that makes them selfish and self centered, but again that is my opinion and you do not legislate one opinion over another).

I can only express those opinions to others, and hope they think about other options, instead of an abortion. Legislating our bodily functions does seem extreme to me and outside of my beliefs of smaller, less intrusive government. There is many things people do to their bodies I do not like, but I still do not want it legislated against.

This is an emotional issue and the fervor it creates when people attempt to debate it results in neither side listening to the other. I am sadden and heartfelt every time I read about or hear from someone that an abortion was performed. However, I do not know what the answer is, when a scientific community cannot agree and our own populace in the United States seems equally split on the issue.

Minden NV
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st pete and sen, u both got it right on as u probably knew... the risk or any way the argument is that this "victory" depending on whatever side of the issue you are on will embolden the states to begin to chip away further and further. as i understand it, the procedure which this decision addressed was is performed only about 3,000. times a years in the entire country...

it will be interesting debate to be sure...

Philadelphia PA
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I have heard of the methods used from the Anti-Abortion side. And they are no less horrific than Partial Birth. Sodium solution which burns the fetus to death, dissection, and I am sure they're are other deplorable techniques. I just think that the line needs to be drawn somewhere before they start talking about killing new borns with "conditions". We can't allow our society to become one in which we kill the weak and imperfect. Although I fear we may already be sliding in that direction. The vanity of the world, the "me first" mentality in which people believe the universe revolves around them. A country without true neighbors, just separate satellites of "Families" who are separate satellites within their homes. A more the 50 percent divorce rate seems to reflect our Narcissism, I'm in now way immune, but I am aware that we have been losing something that had made us better human beings a long time ago. In the end that's my biggest problem with Abortion, it does not seem to make us better as human beings.

Arlington TX
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StPete,

Excellent Points!!! Ones which I overlooked.

Minden NV
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Sen

"First, the Supreme Court decision is not about Abortion BUT Partial Birth Abortion i.e., viable life."

I think you are not 100% correct here. You are right in that it's not a decision on abortion. And you are correct in that it is a decision on Partial Birth Abortion. However, that decision on Partial Birth Abortion is not a decision on "viable" life but only one method of performing an abortion after 12 weeks. There is still another "method" of aborting in excess of 12 weeks. The ban only prohibits the abortion on this method that actually removes the fetus from the womb (born so to speak) before terminating. Another method terminating without removing the fetus from the womb (in other words terminated WITHIN the womb) is NOT banned.

St Petersburg FL
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We have discussed the abortion issue before and I have previously stated I have two distinct and separate views of same. Morally, I do think abortion is wrong and an abomination to the potential of what that unborn life may become. However, legally, as a conservative who believes in small government, individual freedoms and responsibility to one's self, I think abortion should be a legal medical procedure, between a woman and her physician.

Having restated the above several things should be mentioned. First, the Supreme Court decision is not about Abortion BUT Partial Birth Abortion i.e., viable life. Second, the Supreme Court did NOT rule that Partial Birth abortion was illegal, they ruled that society through the legislative process can set standards on when an abortion is acceptable and at what stage it no longer is. Thus upholding the current ban on partial birth abortion. Third, as Dzzy has pointed out, a 5-4 decision, which a large amount of Supreme Court decisions are, demonstrated the complexities of the debate and the issue.

In reading the Supreme Courts decision there is nothing to prevent society from using the legislative process and representative process to vote in representatives and have them write and pass legislation that would allow partial birth abortion. Their ruling only says that the current law that bans partial birth abortion is, in of itself, not illegal.

I know my background is on the enforcement side of the law, not the legal (Court) side, but discussing this with one of my former professors, who happens to be a State District Judge (and now a friend), it seems I am understanding the ruling correctly. At least in his view - lol.

Minden NV
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From the conversation at the desk she had been through the procedure before. That is what changed my thinking and made me wonder if I have been wrong all these years.

Ya know I pay $7.00 a month for my teens birth control pills each month. That to me is a heck of alot cheaper and evassive. If she had honestly felt any remorse or pain from the first time. That $7.00 would have been appealing. That cost is not under her prescription plan it would be much more. That is off insurance through planned parenthood.

I understand accidents and bad judgements in a heated moment. I just don't understand having multiple of them. I would figure once would be enough to learn its better to be safe all the time.

I hope your right Dzzy. I have been having a tough time over the last few days. This was last week that I had the experience so its all very fresh. I am still processing it with in myself. So at the moment I just don't know.

The one nice thing was this young girl came in and sat next to me and she was talking with us to pass time. The she got serious with us and asked why we had decided to do this. I said I have never I have four children. We did share why with her and how much my sister wishes she didn't have this disease. She was afraid because she would be alone. My sister told her of her one child and the reason she made the descision. Shortly after she came over to me my sister had already been taken back. I was in the hall. She had this look of needing a hug so I hugged this young woman. She said wish me luck and thank you for listening to me. I am no longer scared. I am going to be a young mother and I will survive. So that did make my day. I know someone was thinking hard about it.

Bridgeport PA
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manners....like American Express....you should not leave home without them!

Minden NV
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agreed.

i am also amazed at the improper way people act in court as well. the manners of our citizenry certainly are not what they used to be.

Philadelphia PA
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perm,

thoughtful post..

however, if it were me i would not let one room of people in a waiting room change my opinions on abortion. also different people have different ways of handling stress and stressful situations. maybe the joking girl was dying inside and cried her eyes out the night before and after. u never know what people are really thinking.

Philadelphia PA
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TOPIC: Court Backs Ban on Abortion Procedure - Partial Birth Abortions