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Conservative Swingers sorry I just don't get it : Swingers Discussion 21594510491
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TOPIC: Conservative Swingers sorry I just don't get it
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We tend to only call them traitors when they lose. If they win they become Founding Fathers.

I don't think anyone will deny this statement:

There always exists some point where one can justify revolution, violent if necessary, to escape a tyrannical government.

Now - just where that point is... can be debated. Although I don't want to debate it, and no - I don't think we're anywhere in that realm.

Chesapeake VA
 
 
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Maritimers:

"The question of what caused the civil war is complex - economics, culture, states' rights, how to admit new states.... Slavery was integrally related to every one of these issues. Historians write history, full time sex site bloggers merely parrot revisionist themes."

It doesn't matter how integral slavery was, to take up arms against your country and try to use the declaration of independence or constitution as your shield doesn't make you any less of a traitor.

We had open and free elections, laws which are unfair or illegal must only be challenged in court and the combatants lawyers and people making arguments for what is right and what isn't... With the weapons of the spoken and written word.

The use of weapons to make the case, the use of death as a means to say you are right, is no more evolved or promotes the institution of freedom, than raping a woman and declaring her your wife is freedom for woman.

Hazle Township PA
 
 
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We hold that the Government thus established is subject to the two great principles asserted in the Declaration of Independence; and we hold further, that the mode of its formation subjects it to a third fundamental principle, namely: the law of compact. We maintain that in every compact between two or more parties, the obligation is mutual; that the failure of one of the contracting parties to perform a material part of the agreement, entirely releases the obligation of the other; and that where no arbiter is provided, each party is remitted to his own judgment to determine the fact of failure, with all its consequences. In the present case, that fact is established with certainty. We assert that fourteen of the States have deliberately refused, for years past, to fulfill their constitutional obligations, and we refer to their own Statutes for the proof. The Constitution of the United States, in its fourth Article, provides as follows: "No person held to service or labor in one State, under the laws thereof, escaping into another, shall, in consequence of any law or regulation therein, be discharged from such service or labor, but shall be delivered up, on claim of the party to whom such service or labor may be due." This stipulation was so material to the compact, that without it that compact would not have been made. The greater number of the contracting parties held slaves, and they had previously evinced their estimate of the value of such a stipulation by making it a condition in the Ordinance for the government of the territory ceded by Virginia, which now composes the States north of the Ohio River.

Pittsburgh PA
 
 
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"It pretty much all came down to slavery. (How's that for a source?)"

Good source, Poor analysis.. It had to do with the Federal Gov't not enforcing the Constitution, which happened to be related to slavery.

Pittsburgh PA
 
 
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""But surely they were no better than traitors. Their core goal was to perpetuate one of humankind's most repugnant institutions - a truly evil cause that thankfully was defeated."

REAL complex.

Now you're back-peddling.

Pittsburgh PA
 
 
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You call that backpedaling? Man, you really are simple.

In many fields that require intellectual vigor, the question of causation is a very complex one. This is the case in science, law and historical analysis. The shades and nuances of causation are far beyond what a parrot can understand. The parrot can only say, "Money caused the war," or "The war was not about slavery," or "victors write history."

There is no debate about the most immediate cause of the war. It was South Carolina's secession.

There is no debate about the causes for South Carolina's secession. That is because the state announced them in a "Declaration of the Immediate Causes Which Induce and Justify the Secession of South Carolina from the Federal Union."

It pretty much all came down to slavery. (How's that for a source?)

Amherst Canada
 
 
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"The question of what caused the civil war is complex - economics, culture, states' rights, how to admit new states.... Slavery was integrally related to every one of these issues. Historians write history, full time sex site bloggers merely parrot revisionist themes. "

Now the back-peddling and attacks begin. I wish the facts and sources would start too.

Pittsburgh PA
 
 
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The question of what caused the civil war is complex - economics, culture, states' rights, how to admit new states.... Slavery was integrally related to every one of these issues. Historians write history, full time sex site bloggers merely parrot revisionist themes.

Amherst Canada
 
 
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"There are few, I believe, in this enlightened age, who will not acknowledge that slavery as an institution is a moral and political evil. It is idle to expatiate on its disadvantages. I think it is a greater evil to the white than to the colored race. While my feelings are strongly enlisted in behalf of the latter, my sympathies are more deeply engaged for the former."

Robert E. Lee 1856

Pittsburgh PA
 
 
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Ture I'm just saying we are lower on the list than they are.


 
 
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TOPIC: Conservative Swingers sorry I just don't get it