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TOPIC: WTF
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We agree. : )

Carrollton TX
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You are correctt, DD.

What I meant to say (and this might come out wrong too) is that we each have a responsibility for ourselves. To not act inappropriately, to not violate others, and to protect ourselves.

Thanks for checking me on the language.

Fullerton CA
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...and, re: being modest - and I suspect this will be wildly misinterpreted by some here, but that is going to have to be their problem, not mine.

Drawing attention to yourself is a way to increase your chances of being victimized. This is a generic statement and can include how one dresses, how they behave, and what they are obviously carrying. Holding a giant wad of cash in your hand while walking alone dramatically increases one's chance of being mugged. It's still the fault of the mugger, but that doesn't mean acting that way wasn't dumb.

Dressing provocatively of course is *designed* to get attention - the problem is that the bad comes with the good, and the clothes that are intended to get attention from people they want also draws the attention of bad people in exactly the same way that driving a Ferrari gets the kind of oohs and aahs one wants while also potentially catching the attention of someone who might want to steal it.

Being cognizant of one's risks and mitigating as much as possible is simply being a smart human. SHOULD it be this way? No. But it is.

Windermere FL
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I wouldn't use the words tbr used and I suspect he didn't mean it that way.

A rapist is responsible for their behavior. There is no argument there.

tbr was agreeing with me that there are things people can do to protect themselves and that encouraging them to do so is NOT placing blame on them. This does not mean they are "asking for it", but sometimes they are placing themselves in situations where the chances of something bad happening to them is increased. That goes for a wide range of circumstances where people are victimized.

If I leave a car unlocked with the keys in the ignition, is it my *fault* if my car is stolen? Well, no. But that doesn't mean that it wasn't pretty stupid of me to do that.

Windermere FL
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Um no. Both parties are not equally responsible. The rapist is 100% responsible for the rape.

As a female I must balance my freedom and my safety but even if I choose 100% freedom it is not my responsibility if I am raped.

I know women that have never been to the grocery store alone because of fear. I am just now able to have serviceme come to my house when I am alone although I haven't let my fear hold my hostage in my own home. While my husband went to school, we lived in an unsavory neighborhood. I would put my hair up and put on a hat and a bulky jacket yet I was followed and harassed more often than not, even when I brought my dog.

There are countries that stone women that are raped. Women must be chaperoned and covered from head to toe. How modest is modest enough?

Carrollton TX
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I agree.

Both parties are equally responsible. I may get bashed for this, but if you are walking around in a skin tight dress with nothing underneath it, you are opening yourself up to comment at the very least. No, you are not "asking for it," but as you say, it's all about being aware of your surroundings and keeping safe. That's why you wear seatbelts.

But to pull a Cardinal Neimoller is overstating things a bit...

Fullerton CA
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Fair enough, although if you think your example of the email suggesting that women be vigilant is "blaming the victim" is the exception, remember the whole "Slut Walk" phenomenon?

While the comment that sparked that was certainly out of line, the one you mentioned is absolutely fucking not.

Would anyone say that suggesting that people lock their doors, don't leave valuables where they can be seen, etc is "blaming the victim"? Of course not. It's about risk reduction, and suggesting that people have things they can do to protect themselves is tantamount to blaming them for being victimized is just stupid.

Windermere FL
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Where the heck is ol' Robert? Haven't seen him around in a coons age...

I'm with Fun on this. I think a lot of the reporting on these issues is overblown. I work at one of the largest CSU campuses, and the only thing we have had that comes close to that was a recent email from the campus police.

It seems that a female student had been sexually assaulted in a parking structure, IIRC. The email cautioned women to make sure they were aware of their surroundings.

There was a small group of faculty, staff, and students that took offense to the wording, because while cautioning the female students to be careful, the email did not tell the male students not to sexually assault.

OK. Point taken. There have been one or two other emails in a similar vein (not unusual when you have 40,000 young people in a small space), and they have not admonished females to be cautious, or males to keep their hands to themselves.

The whole "protest" was over in a couple of days, without anything really happening...

These kind of things happen all the time. But there are thousands of other yoga classes that continue to function on college campuses.

You are pointing to an exception to try to prove a point.

Fullerton CA
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You're welcome. Where is that weenie, anyway? I saw a couple of posts in Politics but mostly, he's been quiet lately.

My favorite is his insistence that cashier's drawers tell them what coins to dispense and they are weighted to know exactly what coins are missing i.e. if you give out two nickels instead of a dime, your register will know and you will face disciplinary action. He should publish that theory in "Frontiers in Absurdity".

I'm happy to see that this yoga story is all over the news, especially Canadian news, and the reaction is (mostly) ridicule.

Windermere FL
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VA is absolutely right. The things that we believe are right and just are beginning to be seen as evil.

I was taught that all men are created equal. Never accept charity. Work hard. We're all the same inside. Kill em with kindness. Race doesn't matter.

Now I find that I think this way because of my background and white privilege. I understand a little of what I'm told but so much doesn't make sense - and I'm not sure that it should.

Carrollton TX
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TOPIC: WTF

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