Heart Disease: Swingers Discussion 96017

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TOPIC: Heart Disease

Created by: Simbaxxx Original Starting post for this thread:
New data out and cardilogists are changing their tunes. More than half of all heart attacks occur in people with NORMAL cholesterol levels (below 200). Old school thinking was that high cholesterol levels means heart disease....well, dah, when 50% of all heart attacks occur in people with healthy cholesterol there are obvious other factors happening. Apparently, its not the level of cholesterol by the SIZE of the cholesterol particles. Small dense LDL particles (pattern B) are associated with higher levels of coronary heart disease than large fluffy ones (pattern A). Genes decide which pattern predominates, but your type of diet, lifestyl and supplements can convert small particles to large. So, there is a new test out that measures whether you have pattern A or B particle size cholesterol.

Created by: Simbaxxx
Original Starting post for this thread:

New data out and cardilogists are changing their tunes.  More than half of all heart attacks occur in people with NORMAL cholesterol levels (below 200).  Old school thinking was that high cholesterol levels means heart disease....well, dah, when 50% of all heart attacks occur in people with healthy cholesterol there are obvious other factors happening.  Apparently, its not the level of cholesterol by the SIZE of the cholesterol particles.  Small dense LDL particles (pattern B) are associated with higher levels of coronary heart disease than large fluffy ones (pattern A).  Genes decide which pattern predominates, but your type of diet, lifestyl and supplements can convert small particles to large.  So, there is a new test out that measures whether you have pattern A or B particle size cholesterol.

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User Details are only visible to members.	The LDL phenotype story has been developing for several years. Bear in mind that this is a refinement from the days that we heard only about "cholesterol and triglycerides". Today, we fractionate the molecules and hear about "good" cholesterol (HDL) and "bad" cholesterol (LDL). Simbaxxx refers to the next fractionation of LDL into Patterns A and B, the latter often associated with diabetes and with approximately twofold increase in cardiac risk (varies from study to study). The information is useful in two ways--(a) so that risk can be better stratified and (b) so that some modification of medications can be made. It turns out that the statin class of medications lowers lipids uniformly, but niacin ( a vitamin) and gemfibrozil more selective address the "small dense particles". It would be wrong to focus on small dense particles as a "cause" of heart attacks. Association and causality are quite different. No one knows whether selective attack on these particles will actually change risk of heart attack. The most reasonable approach is to make lifestyle (medical sense here) changes that address diet, exercise and smoking cessation in addition to stress management and, of course, medical interventions such as control of blood pressure and lipids. But don't fixate on a particular value or test. The values and tests help describe populations but do not perform well in predicting the courses of individual patients.
Atlanta GA			Username hidden (383 post)

User Details are only visible to members.	"More than half of all heart attacks occur in people with NORMAL cholesterol levels (below 200)" One should realize that despite this interesting statistic, having cholesterol above 200 could still be a very bad thing. For example, it could be that 100% of people whose cholesterol raises past the 200 mark soon develop a heart attack. In other words, the fact that there are even more heart attacks in the <200 group could simply be due to the fact that there are many more people with cholesterol less than 200. This is just a technical point. It does not invalidate your other comments about particle size, heredity, and the possible beneficial effects of diet in converting from small to large size, etc. I'm myself a big fan of using diet as a means to manage cholesterol. Nice post. Manuel
Pittsburgh PA			Username hidden (1153 post)

User Details are only visible to members.	New data out and cardilogists are changing their tunes. More than half of all heart attacks occur in people with NORMAL cholesterol levels (below 200). Old school thinking was that high cholesterol levels means heart disease....well, dah, when 50% of all heart attacks occur in people with healthy cholesterol there are obvious other factors happening. Apparently, its not the level of cholesterol by the SIZE of the cholesterol particles. Small dense LDL particles (pattern B) are associated with higher levels of coronary heart disease than large fluffy ones (pattern A). Genes decide which pattern predominates, but your type of diet, lifestyl and supplements can convert small particles to large. So, there is a new test out that measures whether you have pattern A or B particle size cholesterol.
Mountain Ranch CA			Username hidden (8750 post)

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TOPIC: Heart Disease