Maybe this is why bdsm and swinging seems at odds: Swingers Discussion 2006661051

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Maybe this is why bdsm and swinging seems at odds: Swingers Discussion 2006661051

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TOPIC: Maybe this is why bdsm and swinging seems at odds

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User Details are only visible to members.	In my experience, Dominance and submission (in the context of D/s relationships) is kind of like sexual orientation. It's rarely either/or. Someone can have a Dominant personality in general, but that doesn't lock them into a prescribed role in the bedroom... though it can. I guess there can be a Kinsey Scale to D/s, with people moving in and out and along that scale as their interests and proclivities evolve. Perhaps the most important thing is to celebrate anyone's genuine exploration of their sexuality, and to discourage artificial assignments and expectations of one's sexuality. The hardest part is to start with the self. Once a person is brutally honest with oneself, then he or she can best participate in a healthy sexual relationship. Easier said than done, sometimes... alas.
New Market MD			Username hidden (193 post)

User Details are only visible to members.	"Are you going to block me again now?" Called that one.... Are you always this predictable? How gauche...
East Fishkill NY			Username hidden (2772 post)

User Details are only visible to members.	LOL Gina! I adore you!
Colts Neck NJ			Username hidden (12312 post)

User Details are only visible to members.	Until I read Sed's response a few posts down, I thought Ghost was talking to himself. Again.
San Antonio TX			Username hidden (6065 post)

User Details are only visible to members.	"p.s. You need to get out of the habit of making assumptions about others, you've accused me of many, many untrue things [drinking, suction boss etc....] while I watched and have not responded in kind. Think about that for a moment." You know I missed this at first but I got a good chuckle when I read it... I've never 'accused' you of drinking (other than perhaps in banter?) the suction boss moniker was bestowed on you for your OWN comments that you have small teeth and no gag reflex. You have to admit it was a genius moniker and it pissed you off SO much that you had me suspended every time I used it. Ignored me? Hardly sister.... As I said though, you are very entertaining.
East Fishkill NY			Username hidden (2772 post)

User Details are only visible to members.	Very funny Sed I find it hilarious that when I respond in a conversational manner you run away from your comments made previously, ignore them or try to 're-twist' those comments in favor of whatever rhetoric of convenience comes to mind for you. Most times you simply insist that you are right and everyone else is wrong, never once answering the questions I raise or even responding to the comments. Woe be to anyone who then endeavors to dissect your comments in detail, taking what you said in each case and responding, you then accuse them of all the ridiculous things you just accused me of or more. Or you call them names as you did this poster. Of course the one thing you NEVER do is triangulate some other forum member into the conversation to make that 'other' person seem even more 'wrong' or 'stupid'. Honest discourse? Hardly, but you sound oh so impressive as you melt down darling :-) You my dear Sed are the queen of deflection and everyone here knows it. Hell, you inspire entire flame wars with your ill conceived invective, then lash out at those respondents as somehow misinformed, lying or just dumb. Doubt me? Read this thread (if you don't have it deleted because you dislike the turn it has taken) from top to bottom and you could highlight every questionable behavior I just outlined... And you accuse me of 'dishonest discourse'? At least your are entertaining....sort of like Fox News; Not what they claim, not very good at what they claim, but at least they are entertaining. Are you going to block me again now?
East Fishkill NY			Username hidden (2772 post)

User Details are only visible to members.	I don't know if I should be honored or concerned, with so many posts all directed at me from the same person. Being the great mood that I'm in right now, I'll go with honored. Ghost, you seem to be under the impression that if you copy and paste snipets, and then assign your interpretation to them, somehow my words will suddenly change. They wont, this is a forum, most people don't have reading challenges and can read whole posts to understand the thread. You've done this to other people in the forums, which turned most of them away from responding to you. The tactic is a dishonest one, it's an attempt to twist the words of others in an attempt to advance your agenda. I do not engage in such a low level discourse, it's just a waste of time and leads to no where other than those who are accustomed to such debate pronouncing themselves the victorious winners of the debate. Reality is quite different though, when people with healthy reading abilities read the entire exchange. You have yourself a great weekend, I certainly will. p.s. You need to get out of the habit of making assumptions about others, you've accused me of many, many untrue things [drinking, suction boss etc....] while I watched and have not responded in kind. Think about that for a moment.
Colts Neck NJ			Username hidden (12312 post)

User Details are only visible to members.	“Being whipped, blindfolded, tied, gagged (insert your favorite SM activity) is mere play if there is no bending of the will. There is zero submission, zero dominance in such exchanges. That kind of interaction is for the purpose of arousal, consider it foreplay that sometimes leads to sex.” Again, your opinion presented as fact. Oh, and when someone disagrees with you simply attack them for being stupid or not listening. Are we beginning to hear the chorus yet? One Twue Way (TM)! MY way! -------------------- “I am a dominant, as is my spouse. Husband though, is by far more dominant than I am, and has been bending my will for over 25 years. I am not a submissive, I am not a bottom, I am dominated.” And you are also one of the rarest and least likely of BDSM relationships that has any chance of longevity. You should be proud of this instead of forcefully insisting that everyone else cleave to your norms. Sadly, I doubt you can see your own behavior anymore than you can see your elbow without a mirror… ------------------------------- “I am being submissive when husband successfully dominates me. But I am not a submissive. " "I still can't get over that bullshit that circulates in the BDSM circles, that submission is a gift! please! keep that gift, it's conditional :).” Ahh, so when someone disagrees you slander them. Then perform a little transference and claim they are emotional and slandering you. Clever but transparent. ---------------------------- “When was the last time you opened up a dictionary? if not recently, please do yourself a favor and look up the meaning of the word submissive. " "In my experience, people who shout that others shouldn't judge are probably the most judgmental of all. Everybody judges, some of us are just more honest about it. “ These two, placed next to each other, speak for themselves. Do you ever actually read what you write before you post it? ----------------- I’m getting bored with this now…maybe more later.. ;)
East Fishkill NY			Username hidden (2772 post)

User Details are only visible to members.	“Dominant is what you are, a personality, you either have it or you don't. You can not switch it on and off.” You do love to beat on semantics and word meanings don’t you? Yes Sed, ‘Dominant’ is what you are. You can also ‘display dominance’, ‘dominate a person’, have a dominant personality and be in a ‘dominant position’ all without ‘being a Dominant’. I happen to agree with you, but I also know some pretty convincing switches… But again you state it as fact leaving no one an inch to disagree., and when and if someone DOES challenge you, you point to this 'definition' as a way to shut down any debate. See anything dysfunctional here? “It has nothing to do with with general BDSM and everything to do with dominance and submission, which is where the thread has meandered to. “ I think you are attempting to dominate the conversation, but then that's your MO now isn't it? --------------------------------- “It has nothing to do with Master or slaves or any labels, and everything with logic.” Your logic. My logic says differently. Why is yours better, because you said so? --------------------------------------- “We're talking about dominance and submission. Not a scene, not playing.” To some they are one and the same. Who set you in place to make the rules and definitions? Another cobble in this long path of One Twue Way (TM) statements… ------------------------------
East Fishkill NY			Username hidden (2772 post)

User Details are only visible to members.	sigh) OK, let's get to it... "Your reading comprehension skills have a problem as of late. Last night you accused VA of things that he hasn't said. Now you're claiming that I am claiming one true way? really? or are you still worked up because I pointed out to you that you are accusing VA of things that he hasn't said? :)" Actually I addressed this in detail as I will this post of yours. Whilst you and he both like to make definitive statements about what should and should not be 'allowed' or 'tolerated' as well as 'judging' as you so kindly admitted to doing (yes, as we all do) you seem to dislike the fact that some here are willing to call you on your wording and your 'meanings'. But please, do begin with an attack statement as a preemptive strike, making it my fault because I can't read... Sometimes a clever tactic, but you overuse it a tad Sed You state an opinion as fact leaving no one any room to disagree. This is a One Twue Way (TM) MO if ever there was one. “If one is able to give control, then the one that the control was given to, is not really in control. Control can not be given. Control is taken, just as submission cannot be conditional. Submission occurs in the face of successful dominance.” This is your OPINION Sed, not a Universal fact even though you think it should be. I actually happen to agree with SOME of what you say here, but I will defend the right of others to disagree for themselves. You seem to NEED people to agree with you or ‘submit’ to your judgment of what it should or should not be. ----------------------------------------- “You describe a top and bottom interaction. There is zero submission when you are able to give or take control while in a bottom position. There is nothing wrong with it, it's just not dominance nor submission. It's enjoyable play for all who are involved. “ Again, your opinion and you have a right to it. You do NOT have the right to state it as a fact as you do here and elsewhere (not one single IMHO in the entire thread BTW). ---------------------------------------------------
East Fishkill NY			Username hidden (2772 post)

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TOPIC: Maybe this is why bdsm and swinging seems at odds