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And when I am in the bliss of orgasm, I am most free. I am myself more than at any other time."

that is awesome...and I think we all need that place. Mine is when I dance. I am a selfish dancer. I do not do it to flirt, to be sexual or to get close to anyone but myself. I could very well dance alone and be just as happy as when I dance with someone else. For me, going to the club and dancing is akin to most people going to church. I release stress and I do not have to be the pretty girl, I dont have to be the well dressed one, the smart one or the funny one. I get to be just me.


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Gina, You are awesome! Can we talk you into running for president...or pope? Oh that's right, the morons who run my church don't want to share with women. Oh well. I believe in what you preach Gina. Jon

Crofton MD
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hahaha...I'm smiling. "let the choir sing."

Wild, what I've learned is that "sin" relates to anything you do (or don't do) that consciously or intentionally hurts yourself or another person. In that context, as long as you are not hurting anyone, I think anything you do is "ok." You have to sort that out for yourself, but pretty much anything can fit into that category. It's when we look at life through other people's eyes we tend to question what we do. In our society, sharing your body with another person is considered "wrong." In other societies, not covering a woman's body from head to toe is "wrong." You get the idea.

Is drinking a sin? For some people, it may well be. If by drinking you take away from your family, you are abusive, violent, commit a crime, ruin your body, spend money that puts you in debt, and so on, then yeah, it could be seen as a "sin." If you enjoy a social drink, aren't destroying property or another person's life, or your own, then it's just part of the joy of life. Same can be said for eating. When I sit down with a bag of chips, I am hurting my body, my blood sugar, shortening my life, not dealing with "something," etc. When I shorten my life by overeating, then I am also hurting my husband and those who love me. When you look at spirituality and religion in this way, it opens your mind to see things in a different light. Even Jesus did things that the religious leaders of his day thought were sins: helping someone on the sabbath comes to mind. It was "wrong" in the Pharisees' eyes and they called him on it. He said, Which of you if you had a lamb that fell into a ditch wouldn't help it out on the sabbath? Of course, he was right in "working" on the sabbath. If he's our "example," then we should use reason in determining what constitutes right or wrong in our own personal lives and not just take the word of some minister or elders who probably never have to face whatever decision we choose to make about ourselves.

It can apply to anything. If by swinging I am taking time and attention away from my husband, then yes, I would feel wrong. If by swinging, we are enjoying it together, enhancing our relationship, meeting some really great people and sharing our bodies together in mutuality, then why should I feel wrong about that just because other people think/say/project that it is wrong?

I grew up not allowed to dance, not allowed to have playing cards in the house, etc. What the? It takes a long time to wipe that out and learn that life is enjoyable, that you can experience things without compromising your beliefs, or yourself and others. If what I do or don't do is hurting someone, then I would look at that and reconsider. As it stands, for us, swinging is a pleasure we share discreetly and privately and together with others who feel and think similarly.

Gina

San Antonio TX
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"How that relates to the topic of pictures, well..."

Gina, your post brought all sorts of wonderful pictures to my mind! Mmmm, what a great way to start my day... ;-)

Sheboygan Falls WI
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OH, and thank you. I DO feel like your big sister:)

San Antonio TX
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Toledo, haven't you learned by now that any thread gets "off topic?" ;)

Was raised Southern Baptist, in a strict, adoptive non-nurturing, rule oriented, oppressive, abusive, fundamentalist, southern ignorant family. Yep. It taught me a lot about how I did NOT want to be. And to eschew what I didn't want/like about that and embrace the things I wanted/liked. I had to sort of divorce myself, in ways, from both my birth family members and also my adoptive family members. I learned from my military husband that friends become your family, and a lot of times, are more than what you can get from family.

As for religion, it took a catholic family to teach me that I was loved. But I always say that I am spiritual rather than religious. My faith is personal, private, and my own. As I don't push my sexuality on others, I also don't push religion. The principals I have are imbedded and are instead a part of how I act (NO NOT PERFECTLY) rather than in words only. At any rate, I certainly have fun "arguing" religion, and can match wits with just about anyone. That's kind of fun sometimes. But deep down, my spirituality goes hand in hand with my sexuality in many ways. And no, not just in the "oh god oh god oh god" moments! I have actually thanked God for my clit...yeah, I really have. I mean, okay, what purpose does it serve other than pleasure? How cool is THAT creation? He/She (whatever you believe) didn't have to give us that wonderful little part of our amazing bodies. Think about it. And when I am in the bliss of orgasm, I am most free. I am myself more than at any other time. I feel. I don't think, I don't put myself down, I don't let negativity rule, I don't have gripes or complaints or problems or aches and pains...I am in a place that is spiritual to me, and in that place, I am a wondrous creation.

Yeah, okay, it sounds poetic and mystic and, yeah, I'll admit it: weird. There's more to it than what I write here. I find beauty in some of the rituals of religion, and a tranquility in some of its aspects. I think it's a very personal thing.

How that relates to the topic of pictures, well...

Gina

San Antonio TX
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Cradle Catholic here and all too happy to ring in on the subject. Given the forum at hand, should we move this to a new topic?

Toledo OH
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i was raised catholic, and then as an adult I was pentecostal for a long time...believe it or not. I still hold fast to alot of the pentecostal old school views...but not to the "we are the only ones that know the way" train of thought. I think that there are many, many ways to find God and enlightenment. Now we are pretty much non denominational since Jay was brought up more methodist. We need something, these boys are full of the devil lol


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I am, yes. It is no longer that bad. My friend Gina, who I met through these very fora, is my angel. She is someone I hold dear to my heart, and she has helped me tremendously in this area. I have recently come to a realization. Because my father was raised by an emotionally frigid mother and a father who suffered from manic depression like he does....its not that he does not love me; he does not know HOW to love me. I no longer take it personally like I have and I feel pity for him vs. anger. When he says things like that I do not like it...but I no longer get stung by it either. But yes, I am religious as well.


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Self-image comes from believing that what others say about you is true."

Absolutely....and it comes from giving a shit about what others think about you. I am almost 40, and I am WAY past where I was only 5 years ago. Actually, my pastor opened my eyes. I was talking with him about my serious issues in this area. He said think of it this way. Other people. They have no power to send you either to heaven or hell....so what does it matter, what they think? If you allow them to affect you, you give them control. It was like an ephiphany to me. It is hard though, getting past my father being my father. I try to accept the fact that he is just a shitty father and that its not personal. But just last week, when I told him I was going to do my PET scan to make sure my cancer has not recurred...and he said "better you than me." Thanks.


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